Thử thách Việt-->Anh (No.2)

Hello Sil,
Thank for reminding me. As the matter of fact, I hav not written formal mails 4 a long time. I get used to with letters 4 buddies .Anyway, thanks. I appreciate that
YourS sincerely (well, it sounds strange to me)
To all : guys, u make me confusing . However, that''''''''s better to know more. But I need someone who can verify all things (I dont mean the translation, I mean the usage of some words u mentioned cuz i see somehow u r not sure). Although my major is international economics, I havnt known how to write a biz mail. Please help me as much as possible. Ok ?
Riêng mặt trời, chỉ có một mà thôi. Và mẹ em, chỉ có một trên đời
Được embemuathu sửa chữa / chuyển vào 04:57 ngày 10/09/2003
Được embemuathu sửa chữa / chuyển vào 05:01 ngày 10/09/2003

Bravo guys (and gals) .. It''s really nice to see that many of you here are very experienced in English speaking and writing. Your skills have impressed me tremendously. I could learn something from every reply in this topic. I hope each of you will continue to participate in various discussions in English Club, utilize your knowledge and skills to help others (like myself) in improving our abilities in excercising English.
Sil, Gerbich, spinesplitter, maradona84 and bé embemuathu .. once again, bravo!
"Nguyện mỗi người có một niềm vui"

Bravo guys (and gals) .. It''s really nice to see that many of you here are very experienced in English speaking and writing. Your skills have impressed me tremendously. I could learn something from every reply in this topic. I hope each of you will continue to participate in various discussions in English Club, utilize your knowledge and skills to help others (like myself) in improving our abilities in excercising English.
Sil, Gerbich, spinesplitter, maradona84 and bé embemuathu .. once again, bravo!
"Nguyện mỗi người có một niềm vui"

Mod CXR : thank you for your feedback and encouragement . I personally think your English is good .
Sil : Thank you for your comment . I am sorry I thought this forum is for people who has English as a second language , but it seems as is English is your first language .
Spinesplitter : I think you are very good with your translations ; your style is very concise and organized , perfect for writing procedures and instructions .
Continuing my previous post and In response to Spinesplitter ''s comment . I admit that I do not completely comprehend the sentence in Vietnamese on " Xin ông cho biết nguyên tắc làm việc của ông ðối với tôi nhý thế nào ? " When I translated this , I wanted to rephrase this into an appropriate business letter and didn''t know that this forum wanted it to be word for word . I apologized for having misunderstood .
I joined this forum because I interested in finding new techniques in translating . I occasionally have trouble interchange English into Vietnamese , and I still can''t find any guideline in translation and probably never will because in every dialect there are certain phrases that doesn''t give the same effect in any other languages .
As I had said , one sentense can be translated into many different ways , as long as the reader gets the concept . Here are some examples to provide that translation is based on the main point not detailed word for word .
1). Mùi Thơm Nước Hoa Có Thể Đưa Bà Vợ Vô Tù .
Sweet Smell of Perfume Could Land Wife in Prison .
2). Mỗi lần bà Jackie xức dầu thơm và thắp sáng các ngọn đèn cầy có mùi, thì điều đó không có nghĩa là bà ta đang có một ý định lãng mạn nào trong đầu. Thật ra, đó chỉ là một ác ý, cơ quan cảnh sát nói như vậy.
When Jackie put on perfume and lit scented candles around the house, it wasn''t romance she had on her mind. It was spite, police say.

3). Ổng dùng một ít sự thật để vặn vẹo thành ra nguyên một câu chuyện láo khoét
He takes a little bit of the truth and twists it into full-blown lies .
4). Đất Hứa = Dreamland ( tại sao không dịch là promise land )
5). Giờ phục vu. = Business hours /office hours ( tại sao không dịch là Serving time ?)
A great day to all

Mod CXR : thank you for your feedback and encouragement . I personally think your English is good .
Sil : Thank you for your comment . I am sorry I thought this forum is for people who has English as a second language , but it seems as is English is your first language .
Spinesplitter : I think you are very good with your translations ; your style is very concise and organized , perfect for writing procedures and instructions .
Continuing my previous post and In response to Spinesplitter ''s comment . I admit that I do not completely comprehend the sentence in Vietnamese on " Xin ông cho biết nguyên tắc làm việc của ông ðối với tôi nhý thế nào ? " When I translated this , I wanted to rephrase this into an appropriate business letter and didn''t know that this forum wanted it to be word for word . I apologized for having misunderstood .
I joined this forum because I interested in finding new techniques in translating . I occasionally have trouble interchange English into Vietnamese , and I still can''t find any guideline in translation and probably never will because in every dialect there are certain phrases that doesn''t give the same effect in any other languages .
As I had said , one sentense can be translated into many different ways , as long as the reader gets the concept . Here are some examples to provide that translation is based on the main point not detailed word for word .
1). Mùi Thơm Nước Hoa Có Thể Đưa Bà Vợ Vô Tù .
Sweet Smell of Perfume Could Land Wife in Prison .
2). Mỗi lần bà Jackie xức dầu thơm và thắp sáng các ngọn đèn cầy có mùi, thì điều đó không có nghĩa là bà ta đang có một ý định lãng mạn nào trong đầu. Thật ra, đó chỉ là một ác ý, cơ quan cảnh sát nói như vậy.
When Jackie put on perfume and lit scented candles around the house, it wasn''t romance she had on her mind. It was spite, police say.

3). Ổng dùng một ít sự thật để vặn vẹo thành ra nguyên một câu chuyện láo khoét
He takes a little bit of the truth and twists it into full-blown lies .
4). Đất Hứa = Dreamland ( tại sao không dịch là promise land )
5). Giờ phục vu. = Business hours /office hours ( tại sao không dịch là Serving time ?)
A great day to all

Especially to GERBICH!
Appreciate your comments! Want to make clear that I FULLY understand what you''re concerned about. We shouldn''t be word-to-word, simply because it can''t be a translation. If I were given those VN words, such as "mien dat hua", etc, I would definitely convert them to "dreamland", etc. That is to say I recognize the need to translate, not too semantically nor communicatively but both. We always need to avoid the danger of going word-to-word. That''s why many of us find it rather difficult to translate our English writings back into Vietnamese. Otherwise, it would be very easy to translate into English and back, e.g by adopting word-to-word approach.
Nguyen tac lam viec in many legal documents written by NATIVE SPEAKERS is rendered "Working Regulations", or to be more precise "Quy che lam viec/Noi quy cong tac, vv....", which includes things like Business Hours (Gio lam viec); Overtime (Quy dinh lam them gio); Industrial Relations (Quan he giua CHU & TO); etc.............
In the SOURCE text, we''re not 100% SURE if anything like profit-sharing SCHEME is in the author''s mind, so it follows naturally in the RECEPTOR language, we should not go beyond the author. Instead, it''s safe to use Working Reuglations, Working Principles, etc..... However, if it were the source text of my own to be translated by myself, I would choose CODE OF WORK ETHICS!!! DEEP DOWN, I myself counldn''t figure out how to capture the full meaning of that source phrase "nguyen tac lam viec"
e.g: Would you please define/clarify which code of work ethics shall apply to me???
Just a few comments!
P/S: Everyone who knows how to say "Hello" knows it''s dangerous to go "No Star Where" for "Khong sao dau" and things like that. We''re commonly aware of that danger.
<SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 9pt; FONT-FAMILY: Verdana; mso-fareast-font-family: Times New Roman; mso-ansi-language: EN-US; mso-fareast-language: EN-US; mso-bidi-language: AR-SA; mso-bidi-font-size: 10.0pt; mso-bidi-font-family: Times New Roman

Especially to GERBICH!
Appreciate your comments! Want to make clear that I FULLY understand what you''re concerned about. We shouldn''t be word-to-word, simply because it can''t be a translation. If I were given those VN words, such as "mien dat hua", etc, I would definitely convert them to "dreamland", etc. That is to say I recognize the need to translate, not too semantically nor communicatively but both. We always need to avoid the danger of going word-to-word. That''s why many of us find it rather difficult to translate our English writings back into Vietnamese. Otherwise, it would be very easy to translate into English and back, e.g by adopting word-to-word approach.
Nguyen tac lam viec in many legal documents written by NATIVE SPEAKERS is rendered "Working Regulations", or to be more precise "Quy che lam viec/Noi quy cong tac, vv....", which includes things like Business Hours (Gio lam viec); Overtime (Quy dinh lam them gio); Industrial Relations (Quan he giua CHU & TO); etc.............
In the SOURCE text, we''re not 100% SURE if anything like profit-sharing SCHEME is in the author''s mind, so it follows naturally in the RECEPTOR language, we should not go beyond the author. Instead, it''s safe to use Working Reuglations, Working Principles, etc..... However, if it were the source text of my own to be translated by myself, I would choose CODE OF WORK ETHICS!!! DEEP DOWN, I myself counldn''t figure out how to capture the full meaning of that source phrase "nguyen tac lam viec"
e.g: Would you please define/clarify which code of work ethics shall apply to me???
Just a few comments!
P/S: Everyone who knows how to say "Hello" knows it''s dangerous to go "No Star Where" for "Khong sao dau" and things like that. We''re commonly aware of that danger.
<SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 9pt; FONT-FAMILY: Verdana; mso-fareast-font-family: Times New Roman; mso-ansi-language: EN-US; mso-fareast-language: EN-US; mso-bidi-language: AR-SA; mso-bidi-font-size: 10.0pt; mso-bidi-font-family: Times New Roman

English is an experimental language, that is to say you cannot learn it from a book, translating it word-to-word, it is something that HAS to be spoken and used, finely polished through daily used.
Gerbich, English is NOT my first language =). However, I have been using it in a daily context for too long..I feel more comfortable using English over Vietnamese (my Vietnamese is very bad now too ;_; )..but I was born a full and normal Vietnamese. I spoke Vietnamese, wrote in Vietnamese and was even in the Đội Thi Văn Quận lớp 5 haha..^^;; The old days. However, I must admit that I speak English much better than Vietnamese now.
I didn''t mean to say that you should translate it word-to-word, again English is a contextual language that applies to different situations, make it formal or imformal, speaking or writing, joking or serious, ect..=). Which brings me, where did you learn your English? It sounds like you''re experiencing it very directly.

Doi la bien kho..

English is an experimental language, that is to say you cannot learn it from a book, translating it word-to-word, it is something that HAS to be spoken and used, finely polished through daily used.
Gerbich, English is NOT my first language =). However, I have been using it in a daily context for too long..I feel more comfortable using English over Vietnamese (my Vietnamese is very bad now too ;_; )..but I was born a full and normal Vietnamese. I spoke Vietnamese, wrote in Vietnamese and was even in the Đội Thi Văn Quận lớp 5 haha..^^;; The old days. However, I must admit that I speak English much better than Vietnamese now.
I didn''t mean to say that you should translate it word-to-word, again English is a contextual language that applies to different situations, make it formal or imformal, speaking or writing, joking or serious, ect..=). Which brings me, where did you learn your English? It sounds like you''re experiencing it very directly.

Doi la bien kho..

Sil : I have learned English in a few different countries .
spinesplitter : I agree a 100% with you . " I myself counldn''''t figure out how to capture the full meaning of that source phrase "nguyen tac lam viec" Thus , It requires the writer as well as the reader to come from the some point of reference in having a common understanding or communication of an idea or an ideal .
When I first picked up " Ðất Hứa " I did not fully understand what the book was going to be about . Because when I translated the tittle it had 2 possible meanings : The promised land and the Dreamland .
Dreamland gives the reader the sense of fantasy or unreality such as induced by opium or other mind altering drugs .
Promised land or land of promise leads the reader into the idea of a place of opportunity which is up to the individual to realize .
These two images are antithetical to each other and underscore how important words can be in choosing to convey meaning .